Part of human nature is to identify with people, thoughts, ideas
around us. Being able to witness your identification, and moving
beyond it is the real treasure.
On Jan 29, 9:10 pm, Allan H <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Molly your question has my mind running around its dust bins. Most my
> thoughts are not original but more composites of other ideas. They are like
> hand me downs,, like the 3D image comes from watching how people search
> for treasure on sunken vessels, it is rags from a different ?idea?.
>
> My world is a world of rags in the form of other ideas.
> Allan
> On Jan 29, 2012 8:21 PM, "Allan H" <allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
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>
> > Yeah it is kind of like an old dog sappen on his favorite bone.
>
> > it is trying to understand others, and what I have experienced As I have
> > very few friends that like discussing God I talk to myself a lot..which is
> > no problem as I am never really alone,.
> > Allan
>
> > On Sun, Jan 29, 2012 at 3:05 PM, Molly <mollyb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> Not at all irrelevant. did you have more thoughts about this?
>
> >> On Jan 28, 10:19 am, gabbydott <gabbyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > Hi Mol&Rigs, listening to you two I've been asking myself why none of
> >> > you mentions Jung and his description of the collective unconscious. I
> >> > haven't read the Red Book yet, but maybe of of you has and could tell
> >> > me why this is irrelevant to what you are discussing.
>
> >> > On Jan 27, 2:35 pm, Molly <mollyb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > The paramount paradox.
>
> >> > > On Jan 27, 8:21 am, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > > Yes- I've read a lot of Campbell and admire his efforts. In fact, I
> >> > > > was going to put the Oriental Mythology of his Masks of God series
> >> > > > aside to reread- Indian, Chinese and Japanese chapters. I wish I
> >> could
> >> > > > keep certain studies on top of my thinking but maybe I have read so
> >> > > > much there is a chute to forgetfulness or a pit of scrambled
> >> > > > ideas! :-) Oh, dear!
>
> >> > > > However, back to your comment about looking back/within. I consider
> >> > > > there is impossible split between the spiritual and material and yet
> >> > > > that is our struggle to bridge- if possible.
>
> >> > > > On Jan 27, 6:32 am, Molly <mollyb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > > > Do myths disappear? Joseph Campbell mapped common human myth
> >> around
> >> > > > > the word and through time to discover a mechanism something close
> >> to
> >> > > > > common memory - the expression of the same archetypes in real
> >> time,
> >> > > > > isolated incidents around the globe and at the same time. This
> >> > > > > phenomena has occurred throughout human history. This may tell us
> >> > > > > that it is not the looking back that is important, but as Vam
> >> says,
> >> > > > > looking within.
>
> >> > > > > On Jan 26, 5:54 am, rigsy03 <rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > > > > What is original? I might argue that one is simply explicating
> >> what
> >> > > > > > already exists.
>
> >> > > > > > Each generation assumes it has a distinct character- or needs
> >> to prove
> >> > > > > > that it has.
>
> >> > > > > > Was thinking the reason myths disappear is because they were
> >> oral and
> >> > > > > > native languages are usually suppressed by the conquerors. One
> >> also
> >> > > > > > carries family myths- which interfere with deep communication.
>
> >> > > > > > Yes- there are terrible inequities- all the more scandalous
> >> because
> >> > > > > > there really is plenty to go around so the root is greed and
> >> distain
> >> > > > > > for others. Governments only pretend to care for all its
> >> citizens- it
> >> > > > > > picks and chooses.
>
> >> > > > > > We passed the Gilded Age- I would call this the Tinsel Age.
>
> >> > > > > > On Jan 25, 9:45 am, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > > > > > I would say, Vam, that you often jump in the water with an
> >> 'entourage'
> >> > > > > > > of assumptive baggage. I probably dislike citation more than
> >> you and
> >> > > > > > > am not the first. Veblen would be a good start (to use some
> >> rough
> >> > > > > > > citation). These days, you can at least Google the name.
> >> When I
> >> > > > > > > started it meant a trip to the library. Anyone who has the
> >> chance to
> >> > > > > > > read a lot of what's available (this is still remarkably few)
> >> should
> >> > > > > > > discover most of what they thought their own ideas have been
> >> done
> >> > > > > > > before. The idea is no doubt to try to 'stand on the
> >> shoulders of
> >> > > > > > > giants' (itself a wisecrack by Newton on Hooke's dwarfish
> >> stature).
> >> > > > > > > The 'giants' always turn out flawed. Moses is a war criminal
> >> in
> >> > > > > > > Numbers 31, the Greeks, for all their argument, never
> >> produced a
> >> > > > > > > decent one against slavery (the lunatic-religious John Brown
> >> being
> >> > > > > > > better). Many, because they don't read enough, attribute
> >> 'relativity'
> >> > > > > > > to Einstein, but it has a longer and wider history. The
> >> chattering
> >> > > > > > > class reinvents the square wheel all over the place.
>
> >> > > > > > > What if the best of our system is fascist and we have grown
> >> in such
> >> > > > > > > culture, or a caste system? By what processes do we get an
> >> > > > > > > understanding for change from such? Western propaganda would
> >> have us
> >> > > > > > > believe pouring resources into the gullets of the rich is
> >> sensible.
> >> > > > > > > We all live in the gutter. Only some of us lift our eyes to
> >> the
> >> > > > > > > stars. If only I was smart enough to have been first to
> >> that! (Oscar
> >> > > > > > > Wilde) A common jibe by academics is that common sense is
> >> that which
> >> > > > > > > allows us to believe the world is flat - yet flat-earth was an
> >> > > > > > > academic construction - one can actually see the curvature of
> >> the
> >> > > > > > > Earth.
>
> >> > > > > > > What we need is reliable collective memory. Given our
> >> capacity to
> >> > > > > > > pervert, citation is usually used in a highly selective
> >> manner,
> >> > > > > > > usually along with a core academic (religious etc.) narrative
> >> of
> >> > > > > > > exclusion of competing argument. Control of what is reliable
> >> memory
> >> > > > > > > is, of course, just what those in power want to maintain -
> >> perhaps
> >> > > > > > > through principles of Home and Vanity. I will always prefer
> >> the
> >> > > > > > > margins to this, remembering that to oppose tyranny can
> >> pervert into
> >> > > > > > > its support.
>
> >> > > > > > > Deconstruction is only a beginning. I believe its spirit
> >> concerns a
> >> > > > > > > defeat of madness that includes rationalist fantasy and animal
> >> > > > > > > consensus (which I sense as grasping, selfish individualism
> >> easy to
> >> > > > > > > rule).
>
> >> > > > > > > On Jan 25, 3:26 am, Vam <atewari2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > > > > > > > "Is this not an important part of the dynamic
> >> multidimensional mind
> >> > > > > > > > Vam, can you find nothing of value with meeting this view
> >> at least as
> >> > > > > > > > a challenge?"
>
> >> > > > > > > > James, starting with God is a bad idea. Perhaps, ending up
> >> at it is
> >> > > > > > > > what needs to happen. Dawkins was in Jaipur here and I
> >> found his view
> >> > > > > > > > a lot more balanced, less bigoted and militant.
>
> >> > > > > > > > And Neil is right : it must deal with morality. Where his
> >> discourse
> >> > > > > > > > runs dry is when he is quoting other people ! That is also
> >> my
> >> > > > > > > > compelling logic against intellectual property rights. What
> >> damned
> >> > > > > > > > "rights" on knowledge of any kind ? Or, why must we have to
> >> give
> >> > > > > > > > references, when all we wish to say is ours, with us ? If
> >> it's not
> >> > > > > > > > ours, for us to say, we should STFU !
>
> >> > > > > > > > The formal aspect of Truth or truths is onerous. There are
> >> libraries
> >> > > > > > > > out there where it goes dry. It is the informal one that I
> >> wish to put
> >> > > > > > > > across : it is mine... and for that reason should be
> >> everyone's, of
> >> > > > > > > > everything. And that ( informal aspect ) is... HOME. The
> >> search for
> >> > > > > > > > that place which is truly ours, where we can rest without
> >> fear, free
> >> > > > > > > > and fulfilled, which nothing in the whole universe can take
> >> away from
> >> > > > > > > > us. Truth is our Home.
>
> >> > > > > > > > This is no parable I've begun. People are spent for and on
> >> a " home "
> >> > > > > > > > for themselves. They build, buy, rent one for the body...
> >> house or
> >> > > > > > > > apartment, car or craft. But then the worst a-holes amongst
> >> us come to
> >> > > > > > > > believe that home they are so invested on is also the "
> >> home " to
> >> > > > > > > > their emotion, to their thought, their identity, and their
> >> happiness
> >> > > > > > > > too ! Well, it is and it definitely isn't.
>
> >> > > > > > > > The better ( a-hols ) take on a wife, friend, progeny or
> >> pet,
> >> > > > > > > > community or cause, to engage their
> >> emotion-thought-identity where,
> >> > > > > > > > with whom or which, one then feels at home. Of that our
> >> thought is
> >> > > > > > > > preoccupied... that same ' faculty ' that had been used to
> >> focus on
> >> > > > > > > > money to buy the home, on the value of food and worth of
> >> delicacies,
> >> > > > > > > > on the relevance of what is beneficial and serves our
> >> purposes and
> >> > > > > > > > what does not.
>
> >> > > > > > > > That pitch of ' acquisition,' value, worth, relevance... is
> >> also there
> >> > > > > > > > in our thought and eye, as in it pre-exists and is
> >> consciously or
> >> > > > > > > > subconsciously applied, for the home-objects of our emotion
> >> as well.
> >> > > > > > > > For a lifetime, we carry that pitch to manage, manipulate,
> >> decide and
> >> > > > > > > > deal with what is outside us to acquire the material
> >> home-object in
> >> > > > > > > > our aim ... a domain that, for all practical purposes,
> >> encompasses
> >> > > > > > > > everything. For everything, external and internal, is
> >> outside the
> >> > > > > > > > agency, the ego-person, we are through the pursuit after
> >> our aim.
>
> >> > > > > > > > What is concurrent within,
>
> ...
>
> read more »
