Re: Mind's Eye Re: Good and bad

Ego nihil scio ... nihil

On Thu, Mar 28, 2013 at 7:39 PM, archytas <nwterry@gmail.com> wrote:
> She goes weak at the knees over injustice before taking up the courage
> of good sense James. I'm nor sure anything else matters once you know
> that. Another German friend used to act as my straight man in
> lectures on irony. He'd go on for a while and then I'd say - 'so you
> Germans even want to take the humour out of irony then'? If the class
> laughed we'd continue the routine, swapping roles until the real pitch
> on economics - our view being the subject cannot be understood without
> irony and that you need to go further than Socrates' jibes and
> understand it's more than the relief or insult of the joke. If the
> class didn't laugh we'd teach them some maths - usually on derivative
> or other hedging and see if they got the irony in that (it can only
> work in certain conditions excluded from the maths - it's a bit like
> insuring against the certainty that the insurers will have no money
> when you need them to pay out).
>
>
>
>
> Some economists are catching up on where research methods in other
> social sciences were 40 years ago - it's painful to watch. This won't
> help. Some are fixated with school biology notions of brain structure
> (stem, reptilian, limbic and higher - roughly - they call it the
> triune brain). In fact the human body has two brains - the enteric
> nervous system has loads of neurons and lots of any serotonin washing
> about. We know a great deal about the brain (neuroscience) and a lot
> of that comes down to Molly's 'embrace the paradox' - most brain
> states are roughly ones of ambiguity, We are easily conned by actors
> and psychopaths (and may want to be) - and probably bacteria we host.
> Economists cite Hobbes on biology - you'd think they'd read Dawkins!
> I do some of this in class and introduce neuroeconomics. I hope to
> get far enough into this 'new muck' for people to get some handle on
> day-to-day irrationality in our behaviour - it ends in another ironic
> corner - if much of the high paid decision making is so irrational/
> hormone dependent why have we not swept it away by a more rational
> system? And why do we pretend we have?
>
>
>
>
> I do stuff like 24 hour profit and loss (Enron was good at this) -
> this brings sales from, say, 10 years hence (but made now if the
> contract holds for 10 years) into the present. I get asked why and
> show students what their cut would be if they were working as a trader
> in the example and let them choose the pay cheque with or without it.
> I do the same with mine assuming I'm taking over-riders from the
> whole class. I then ask something like 'compare and contrast bonuses
> paid to the UK's 4% financial sector workforce with those pad across
> the whole UK economy (the 4% get 40% of all UK bonuses) and how much
> has been paid out since Lehman in the UK (£60 billion) and a realistic
> estimate of UK bank under-capitalisation (range £25 to £150 billion)'.
> - they should get to what caused what themselves, but most of them are
> making mental notes to apply for jobs where 24 hour P & L is in
> operation.
>
>
>
>
> I take issue with economists who think we teach these students self-
> interests and lack of integrity. I'm just not that good - and anyway
> we do a pre-101 ethics test and economics' majors are always the
> worst. The rot is in long before higher education and anyway those
> with Bildung fell in front of the Nazis like a red carpet. A few of
> the kids get into critical material and are nearly always the best at
> the routine sums - most of my time is spent teaching those to people
> who could never actually see which sums need to be devised, never see
> the spreadsheets they use exclude most of what matters to make them
> balance easily ...
>
> The classic whacky economics 'arguments' are such as the case of the
> Bulgarian pigs - a whole thesis on the doubling of the Bulgarian pig
> industry in 1918 was trashed on the discovery they changed the
> calendar in that year and the excess pigs were awaiting Xmas execution
> (Xmas now coming after measurement date instead of before). One might
> explain trickle down theory or other guff about rigs' 'innovative,
> risk taking rich', point to the vast increase of 1% wealth since
> Lehman and ask for examples of the fell good factor in the class. The
> historical context is that classical economists (Adam Smith, Richardo,
> Hume) were all against this rentier class and wanted free markets free
> of today's rent-seeking predation and the current mainstream is merely
> the ideological adjunct of the current oligarchy. I could butter my
> parsnips, but suspect I wouldn't ease students' ability in this regard
> in a right-wing job market. In the end I don't hold with the
> ideological guff anyway. Swedish labour costs per hour are $40 an
> hour and in Bulgaria they are $4/hr - this in the same trading block
> (EU). It seems a no-brainer to take your business to Bulgaria - until
> you think Sweden has been on of the best places to live since WW1 and
> Bulgaria not. I've worked in both and Sweden wins hands down -
> despite lousy weather.
>
> Very few students have minds open to science or have done much
> science. They should be off seeing the world, preferably on
> international service where the effects of lousy economics and
> politics are felt worst. I've usually been better with students over
> 30 who have worked out mummy and daddy didn't tell them the truth and
> have discovered television is mostly boring.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mar 28, 3:21 am, James <ashkas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> That I've felt a sense of irony about my task says nothing about my
>> salt, it just seems I tensed up and remembered to take a breath 27 years
>> later. That sounds like silly psychobabble but that was the feeling.
>> Your hint at choosing the best parts was quite helpful in retracing time
>> without falling into a hole, thanks gabby and I agree both forward (as
>> you said) and backward. The consistent virtues, in my case intuition and
>> determination, which set the task.
>>
>> You are either tough as nails or trying to pry a laugh outta me gabby,
>> maybe.. ?
>>
>> On 3/27/2013 6:38 AM, gabbydott wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > Ah, the typical Hipster Zeitgeist self-positioning - please consume
>> > with ironic detachment. No, I don't support artificial sweeteners
>> > (bad). I prefer taking the truth with a grain of salt (good).
>>
>> > 2013/3/27 James <ashkas...@gmail.com <mailto:ashkas...@gmail.com>>
>>
>> > It seems to me that the task is set between a conditioned identity
>> > that adapts and acquires knowledge about a perceptual environment
>> > mostly subconsciously on one hand and the other is managing an
>> > exchange between acquired directives and the challenge of
>> > inadequacies (even when wicked and intractable problems present
>> > themselves). How the perceptual environment is absorbed I think
>> > has a lot to do with individual traits, but it seems that however
>> > many levels of emergent systems are involved there is interaction,
>> > communication and adaptation of the different layers (levels,
>> > systems, what have you).
>>
>> > Where it gets interesting is that the background gets filled in
>> > while trying to understand and explain the apparent and intuitive.
>> > That space is where I see the identity acting as an agent, but
>> > more than an agent operating within a 'bounded rationality' (per
>> > se) but a construct of multiple motives competing for attention,
>> > recognition, expression underlying the persona or more intimately
>> > self image and ultimately attenuating the brain to operate within
>> > the basic parameters of this environment for better or worse.
>>
>> > This hypothetical view or variations and thinking systematically
>> > helps tame my brain's attenuations, it doesn't seem to be adapted
>> > well to me but I manage to patch things up here and there with
>> > discipline or bypassing circuits. Long ago my world was fire and
>> > ice, now it has to be bridged somehow- reset the task, it is the
>> > same but different with some place shifting.. I am right-brain
>> > dominant gabby, it is fitting to have a sense of irony about my
>> > ideas, especially my earlier message. :)
>>
>> > On 3/26/2013 3:39 AM, gabbydott wrote:
>>
>> > Unfortunately, no. My agency does not operate on the basis of
>> > an innate, pre-programmed best behavior pattern, it
>> > co-develops with me, and I better define it the best behavior
>> > I can show, which is not true, of course, but it helps me with
>> > my environment. Sorry, who set the task?
>>
>> > 2013/3/26 James <ashkas...@gmail.com
>> > <mailto:ashkas...@gmail.com> <mailto:ashkas...@gmail.com
>> > <mailto:ashkas...@gmail.com>>>
>>
>> > If distortions are the best we can muster lets hope they
>> > fit the
>> > task at hand, now what that is and where in environment and
>> > identity seems very defining no?
>>
>> > On 3/25/2013 5:02 PM, gabbydott wrote:
>>
>> > The Big Picture via distorting filters onto Big Data?
>>
>> > 2013/3/24 andrew vecsey <andrewvec...@gmail.com
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com>
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com>>
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com>
>>
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com>>>>
>>
>> > I do not think that we lie to our self so much as
>> > that we only
>> > see/hear what we want to see/hear. Also we tend to
>> > say what we
>> > think the other persons wants to hear or say things to
>> > hurt other
>> > people.
>>
>> > On Sunday, March 24, 2013 10:46:03 AM UTC+1, rigs
>> > wrote:
>>
>> > I am more interested in why we lie to
>> > ourselves, suppress
>> > reality and
>> > snarl logic in our brains. There are life and
>> > death
>> > moments of
>> > survival, I suppose, but much of our potential is
>> > engineered
>> > by family
>> > and culture in order to achieve some sort of
>> > control and
>> > order. Even
>> > rebels are often little more than a reaction.
>> > Pretense and
>> > etiquette
>> > are often the same thing.//I must have "lost" my
>> > thought re "big
>> > data"/"Big Daddy? as an organizer of human
>> > knowledge
>> > versus the
>> > present scatterings and specialties.// Yes- I
>> > agree
>> > most have
>> > a gut
>> > reaction- but so do other life forms- it's a
>> > survival
>> > mechanism. But
>> > it can be distorted.
>>
>> > On Mar 24, 4:12 am, andrew vecsey
>> > <andrewvec...@gmail.com
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com> <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com>>> wrote:
>> > > Faked enthusiasm is as easy to spot as fake
>> > love. It
>> > is like
>> > a built in
>> > > like a lie detector that god created us
>> > with. Sounds
>> > like a
>> > good way to
>> > > detect lying on the internet. You can call
>> > it "god"
>> > instead
>> > of "big
>> > > brother".
>>
>> > > On Saturday, March 23, 2013 6:08:39 PM UTC+1,
>> > archytas wrote:
>>
>> > > .....................
>>
>> > > > Quite what junk DNA is has raised a big recent
>> > controversy
>> > - gist at
>>
>> > >http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2013/feb/24/scientists-attacked-ove...
>>
>> > > > I agree with rigs that the term is
>> > unfortunate.
>>
>> > > > ........but I could feign 'enthusiasm' ..
>> > > > ........' to detect resistance! Even this
>> > > > .....no employees dumb enough to support
>> > > > excellence, ......
>> > > > if we spent out time pointing such devices at
>> > > > each other though rigs! Watch out for the
>> > first one
>> > minute dating
>> > > > agency providing such! Arghh" .
>>
>> > > > On Mar 22, 1:06 pm, rigs
>> > <rigs...@gmail.com <mailto:rigs...@gmail.com>
>> > <mailto:rigs...@gmail.com <mailto:rigs...@gmail.com>>>
>> > wrote:
>> > > > > Junk is an unfortunate adjective- it
>> > sounds too
>> > random.
>> > My guess is
>> > > > > that further selection takes place in
>> > this area
>> > which
>> > selects the
>> > > > > strongest marker- or whatever it's
>> > called- such
>> > in the
>> > color of eyes,
>> > > > > hair, and other characteristics. There
>> > are also
>> > generational skips in
>> > > > > play. I have noted other strange echoes
>> > of a missing
>> > parent such as
>> > > > > the style of laughter which is a
>> > surprise and so
>> > many other
>> > > > > recognitions. At any rate, we are just
>> > beginning
>> > to sort
>> > through the
>> > > > > data in this one area as in others- I
>> > think it
>> > is called
>> > "big data"
>> > > > > which will overcome the religious notion of
>> > "sins of the
>> > father" stuff
>> > > > > as well as curses and fate and will
>> > hopefully
>> > allow a
>> > more rational
>> > > > > and postive approach/life choices for
>> > each unique
>> > individual. But it
>> > > > > will also cause mischief.
>>
>> > > > > On Mar 22, 5:16 am, andrew vecsey
>> > <andrewvec...@gmail.com
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com>
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com
>> > <mailto:andrewvec...@gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > Not all DNA code for
>>
>> ...
>>
>> read more »
>
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|_D Allan

Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.

Of course I talk to myself,
Sometimes I need expert advice..

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