Mind's Eye Re: Can there be any rational discussion of religion?

True, faith cannot be reasonsed out, dogma can and should be though, and although faith in and of itself is surly sans reason, reasoning can be applied to bits and bobs.

 

To simplyfy.

 

I belive in God, I can't reasonably tell you why, but I can explain my reasoning behind what it is I belive about God. 
On Friday, 10 August 2012 14:32:33 UTC+1, rigsy03 wrote:

Faith cannot be reasoned out. It is belief versus reality. It is also
a choice like the acceptance of various emotions.

On Aug 9, 9:06 am, archytas <nwte...@gmail.com> wrote:
> A Muslim sect has been found keeping most of its members living
> underground in squalor (Russia).  Charges will include child cruelty.
> I'm always depressed when people want to discuss beliefs in their blue
> and white rabbit-gods and particularly when  official religions demand
> respect.  I think rationality disappears in religious discussion and
> this essentially hides pretty brutal power-plays that are about
> genetic-hierarchical manipulation.  This doesn't leave me dismissive
> of all religion - we should be looking for more sub-conscious
> recognition of peace and the wiles of self-deception.
>
> Veblen argued (1910 ish) that the leisure class exert a control fraud
> on the rest of us and that economics is essentially religious.
> Handing political power to religious freaks as in practical Islam is
> as mad as the days of the utterly disgusting Crusades, but one can see
> the appeal of a way of life free of clown capitalism at the same
> time.  Religion was once much more closely related to freeing people
> from he master class - many of its early words are about freedom from
> debt, debt peonage and coming home from indenture in jubilee.  The
> real tale of kicking over the tables of temple money-lenders has some
> parallels with current attacks on the USD as the reserve currency.
>
> I hope it is clear I have plenty of time for, say, RP and Molly and I
> miss Orn a lot.  Keeping ourselves honest on religion is difficult -
> rigsy often says, effectively, debate is circular and more or less
> meaningless, perhaps because we have cut our mutual understanding in
> advance.  My own interest is why so much performed rationality is
> really religious - economics is the classic.  The Governor of the Bank
> of England is now saying no one knows what will happen in Europe and
> hence no one knows what will happen in Blighty.  Instead of resigning
> as a hapless incompetent he is urging the Olympic spirit on the
> nation.  He looks like a vicar in classic C of E mode.
>
> There are various tricks in religious argumentation like 'seeing the
> light' as a ersult of introspection not amenable to demonstration.
> Yet we need vision of some other way to live.  I wonder what religion
> might be without such standard manipulations?

--