You are bound by your psyche, but your psyche does not rule you. You can if you wish or if you choose, make an effert through a force of will to calm down, you can if you so choose to not react in anger. Of course you can also effect a change in your psyche in accordance with your will, or do you deny this?
Or are you claiming here that our emotions rule us? The free choice is that you are able to choose at all, yes yes, you are of course restricted in your choices, you cannot fly unaided for example, but you can of course choose to throw your tea or not, you do have that control.
Detriminism, or more properly the belife in it, is certianly a faith based belief, unless of course we can show each and every constituant that somehow forces your actions, then you are simply placing faith in determinism.
Of course you know me and so you may understand that I see nothing inherently wrong in faith based belife and claim it more prevalent that is commonly thought, however what place has it in the process of logical reasoning?
In another post at the moment there is much talk about being slaves and not free to do as we wish, I can't get with this at all, it seems so clearly and completely wrong. We have 100% freedom of choice (within our bounderies). We can choose not to be enslaved by wages, our vast history of counter culture shows us this is possible, but being as we are creatures of intelect and emotion and society, and seeing as our world currently follows the great God Cash, this choice is not taken up by many.
There is a foolhardy saying about freedom of speech and us noty being free to shout fire in a packed theatre, this is also clearly not true. You can of course shout any words you like in a packed theatre (what force is stopping you from doing so?) however cause and effect being what it is means that if you where to shout such a thing, then you have to bear the consequences. Hah hah of if you choose not to, then you can run away and try not to be caught, not an action I sanction of course, but an exaple of freedom of choice.
On Wednesday, 6 June 2012 11:36:11 UTC+1, RP Singh wrote:
I am sitting near my bed and sipping tea in a very cool frame of mind
, even the thought of spilling tea doesn't come to my mind. But on
another day I am very unhappy due to various reasons and am feeling so
frustrated that I become so agitated that I don't spill tea but
actually throw the whole cup on my bed. I am the same person but the
circumstances and my psyche at that moment are completely different ,
so where is my freedom of choice ? Am I not actually bound by my
psyche ? Is not freedom of will just a belief ?
On Wed, Jun 6, 2012 at 3:17 PM, Lee Douglas <leerevdouglas@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think that is a massive statment to make, so heh let me make another one.
>
> If we are to belive cause and effect, and surley there is no getting away
> from it, then all things are bound by their nature, enviroment and verious
> other things. So to claim that we have no free choice because we, like
> everything else, are bound by our nature and enviroment, I think is wrong,
> and far to simplistic a way to see things.
>
> Our freedom of choice lies in the fact that we can indeed choose. You may
> not spill tea on your bed because knowing that you wpuld not liek to soil
> your bed you may choose not to take your tea anywhere near it. However the
> fact remains that if you choose, disoite your dislike of gettiong hot tea on
> your bed, you can still walk over to you bed, cup in hand and tip the whole
> thing over it.
>
> We are free to choose within the bounds that we have and that my friend is
> what we mean by free will.
>
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, 5 June 2012 18:15:24 UTC+1, RP Singh wrote:
>>
>> Why don't I spill tea on my bed ? One reason is that it would spoil my
>> bed , another is that I hold myself responsible for any such action.
>> But does that make me really free in the matter of choice ? Nope! my
>> choice is bound by my psyche, which in turn is bound by matter in the
>> form of this human body and the environment interacting with it.
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