Re: Mind's Eye self forgiveness

I was just reading the news, a rare occurrence, another reminder why..
Somewhere under contempt, anger, and shame is will, a couple leaps
further to hope, pride gets a bad treatment in the process but is
replaced with resolve. One matter stands out though. That is the role of
acceptance and how it can develop into affirmations, I think that comes
into the resolve stage.

Just a few of my reflections, I am certainly open to input.

On 7/21/2012 10:21 PM, James wrote:
> And predators of every sort, it is hard to resist the urge to stand in
> front like a wolverine at times. Some things turn the stomach, white
> heat is one, but it pays to understand the flame.
>
> On 7/20/2012 2:22 AM, Allan H wrote:
>> Personally I do take my personal responsibility very seriously,, but I
>> am not preoccupied or at least I hope.. I do think there is a certain
>> responsibility one has to keep vigilance and pull the fire alarm when
>> there is a 'fire' unfortunately there are a lot of fires..
>> Allan
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 20, 2012 at 6:30 AM, James <ashkashal@gmail.com
>> <mailto:ashkashal@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Not sure if they would like the term "preoccupation" with the
>> connotation of cultural values laden judgment but it sounds fair.
>> Mostly his perspective sounds reasonable given circumstances and I
>> can relate to a bit of it, but "morbid" seemed the best way to
>> describe the challenges. For one this person takes personal
>> responsibility very seriously but gives no sign of it because it is
>> a "vulnerability" people will take advantage of, he seems to have an
>> automatic fear response to happiness (seems like hypervigilance but
>> might be pathological fear), is very opposed personally to
>> spontaneous or excited behaviors but sees it as self discipline and
>> carefully manages what thoughts or emotions are shown. Much of this
>> sounds like he took life's lessons a little too seriously from a
>> young age, but that is where identity comes into play. The
>> existential definition that I think results by one's experience with
>> the world, and how that shapes subconscious behaviors, not known but
>> responded to automatically. I think that is where much of the
>> difficulty comes from in his case, the nature of his existence
>> defined by the world, and the resistant morbid part is the response
>> to those pressures. Where the world judged him harshly for being
>> different he learned most couldn't find waldo on a plain sheet of
>> paper. After listing a number of things that are different he had a
>> smile and pointed out that his challenges are not so different from
>> that of many others except the circumstances (existential definition
>> I take it) in sum were not typical enough for conventional answers,
>> they all lead back to square one.
>>
>> It was strange to hear strong emotions from such a disciplined
>> person but I found it somewhat relieving, he still doesn't fit the
>> mold on offer, it is inspiring. So I'm not sure what kind of advice
>> to give or ask about, perhaps there is more perspective out there
>> somewhere?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 7/19/2012 6:35 PM, rigsy03 wrote:
>>
>> I had another thought on self-forgiveness/morbid preoccupation: One
>> may have lost all perspective and forgotten the suffering in this
>> world and neglected to count the blessings. Then it also depends on
>> one's culture which might inflict a very distorted view of
>> anything it
>> choses so the individual doesn't know any better. Families can
>> also be
>> so dysfunctional that normal doesn't exist or develop properly.
>>
>> Not sure the doctors are making profits as much as insurance and
>> drug
>> companies, shrinks and "counsellors". Then, the attorneys!
>>
>> On Jul 19, 11:44 am, Allan H<allanh1...@gmail.com
>> <mailto:allanh1...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Morbid would be an excessive preoccupation with and event or
>> sin.. Finally
>> started to figure it out..
>>
>> Yes I know of the excessive cost of people taking advantage
>> of a program
>> that can be for free. When I came into AA the rich mans
>> programs were just
>> starting.. I was to poor so they didn't want anything to do
>> with me.. so I
>> became sober the old fashion way, not drinking and going to
>> meetings.. it
>> will still work today but that is to cheap for the greedy
>> medical
>> community.
>> Allan
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 19, 2012 at 3:38 PM, rigsy03<rigs...@yahoo.com
>> <mailto:rigs...@yahoo.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Jumping in here- my idea of "morbid guilt" would be that
>> which
>> paralyzes development past a trauma. It is different
>> than the tumbling/
>> domino reaction that a traumatic event sparks- more like
>> physics or
>> chemical reaction, in a way. But...what is identity?
>>
>>
>> I don't find you "simple", Allan. Why do you disparage
>> yourself? Thank
>> you for being "here" so loyally- whatever "here" means! :-)
>>
>>
>> Back to your comment about AA- essentially a seflish
>> program of
>> necessity. Older alcoholics who had money would go to
>> spas and
>> steambath their way to sobriety- until the next bout. I
>> never even
>> heard of AA until I was in my 30's- at that point I
>> joined an Alanon
>> group at a nearby church but think the divorce rate
>> pretty high from
>> that group- it probably was part of the motive of
>> joining up- keeping
>> score, so to speak, rather than understanding the
>> spiritual element.
>> At the same time, treatment centers started springing
>> up- last I
>> heard, getting sober might cost 5 figures a month. There
>> is another
>> element now of drug addicts going to AA rather than
>> narco-something
>> which introduces a whole new can of worms. Anyway, I
>> think drinking
>> alone is what got me in trouble when all the children
>> had "graduated"
>> the nest- but I was ripe, anyway. lol I really don't
>> miss drinking but
>> have thought if I got a fatal diagnosis in the future, I
>> might need a
>> few shots of single malt whiskey to ease the way to
>> eternity.
>>
>>
>> On Jul 19, 2:48 am, Allan H<allanh1...@gmail.com
>> <mailto:allanh1...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I know I am simple James, but what do you mean by
>> morbid guilt?
>> Allan
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 19, 2012 at 5:59 AM,
>> James<ashkas...@gmail.com
>> <mailto:ashkas...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> On 7/17/2012 6:50 AM, Molly wrote:
>>
>>
>> I have a friend who is contemplating self
>> forgiveness. Any
>>
>> suggestions?
>>
>>
>> Look back from a context of greater maturity, in
>> the meantime apply
>>
>> time
>>
>> and experience: pursue excellence, appreciate
>> moderation, respect
>>
>> processes.
>>
>>
>> Through personal growth pieces of the story
>> begin falling in place,
>> motives are replaced with expanded and stronger
>> ones.
>>
>>
>> Morbid guilt might be another matter, where it
>> mixes with identity
>>
>> seems
>>
>> very elusive. I have a friend that would much
>> appreciate your input.
>>
>>
>> --
>> (
>> )
>> |_D Allan
>>
>>
>> Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.
>>
>>
>> --
>> (
>> )
>> |_D Allan
>>
>> Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.- Hide quoted
>> text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> (
>> )
>> |_D Allan
>>
>> Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.
>>
>>
>>
>