Re: Mind's Eye self forgiveness

In case anyone is wondering he is okay with my posting, and found it
humorous to point out people will probably think I am talking about
myself, and saying so would make it more obvious. I told him it
shouldn't (as in ought not) make a difference, and he shot me an
appreciative grin at the sentiment, "Indeed, but this is your project."
What an interesting fellow. lol

On 7/20/2012 12:30 AM, James wrote:
> Not sure if they would like the term "preoccupation" with the
> connotation of cultural values laden judgment but it sounds fair. Mostly
> his perspective sounds reasonable given circumstances and I can relate
> to a bit of it, but "morbid" seemed the best way to describe the
> challenges. For one this person takes personal responsibility very
> seriously but gives no sign of it because it is a "vulnerability" people
> will take advantage of, he seems to have an automatic fear response to
> happiness (seems like hypervigilance but might be pathological fear), is
> very opposed personally to spontaneous or excited behaviors but sees it
> as self discipline and carefully manages what thoughts or emotions are
> shown. Much of this sounds like he took life's lessons a little too
> seriously from a young age, but that is where identity comes into play.
> The existential definition that I think results by one's experience with
> the world, and how that shapes subconscious behaviors, not known but
> responded to automatically. I think that is where much of the difficulty
> comes from in his case, the nature of his existence defined by the
> world, and the resistant morbid part is the response to those pressures.
> Where the world judged him harshly for being different he learned most
> couldn't find waldo on a plain sheet of paper. After listing a number of
> things that are different he had a smile and pointed out that his
> challenges are not so different from that of many others except the
> circumstances (existential definition I take it) in sum were not typical
> enough for conventional answers, they all lead back to square one.
>
> It was strange to hear strong emotions from such a disciplined person
> but I found it somewhat relieving, he still doesn't fit the mold on
> offer, it is inspiring. So I'm not sure what kind of advice to give or
> ask about, perhaps there is more perspective out there somewhere?
>
>
>
> On 7/19/2012 6:35 PM, rigsy03 wrote:
>> I had another thought on self-forgiveness/morbid preoccupation: One
>> may have lost all perspective and forgotten the suffering in this
>> world and neglected to count the blessings. Then it also depends on
>> one's culture which might inflict a very distorted view of anything it
>> choses so the individual doesn't know any better. Families can also be
>> so dysfunctional that normal doesn't exist or develop properly.
>>
>> Not sure the doctors are making profits as much as insurance and drug
>> companies, shrinks and "counsellors". Then, the attorneys!
>>
>> On Jul 19, 11:44 am, Allan H<allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Morbid would be an excessive preoccupation with and event or sin..
>>> Finally
>>> started to figure it out..
>>>
>>> Yes I know of the excessive cost of people taking advantage of a program
>>> that can be for free. When I came into AA the rich mans programs were
>>> just
>>> starting.. I was to poor so they didn't want anything to do with me..
>>> so I
>>> became sober the old fashion way, not drinking and going to
>>> meetings.. it
>>> will still work today but that is to cheap for the greedy medical
>>> community.
>>> Allan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jul 19, 2012 at 3:38 PM, rigsy03<rigs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> Jumping in here- my idea of "morbid guilt" would be that which
>>>> paralyzes development past a trauma. It is different than the tumbling/
>>>> domino reaction that a traumatic event sparks- more like physics or
>>>> chemical reaction, in a way. But...what is identity?
>>>
>>>> I don't find you "simple", Allan. Why do you disparage yourself? Thank
>>>> you for being "here" so loyally- whatever "here" means! :-)
>>>
>>>> Back to your comment about AA- essentially a seflish program of
>>>> necessity. Older alcoholics who had money would go to spas and
>>>> steambath their way to sobriety- until the next bout. I never even
>>>> heard of AA until I was in my 30's- at that point I joined an Alanon
>>>> group at a nearby church but think the divorce rate pretty high from
>>>> that group- it probably was part of the motive of joining up- keeping
>>>> score, so to speak, rather than understanding the spiritual element.
>>>> At the same time, treatment centers started springing up- last I
>>>> heard, getting sober might cost 5 figures a month. There is another
>>>> element now of drug addicts going to AA rather than narco-something
>>>> which introduces a whole new can of worms. Anyway, I think drinking
>>>> alone is what got me in trouble when all the children had "graduated"
>>>> the nest- but I was ripe, anyway. lol I really don't miss drinking but
>>>> have thought if I got a fatal diagnosis in the future, I might need a
>>>> few shots of single malt whiskey to ease the way to eternity.
>>>
>>>> On Jul 19, 2:48 am, Allan H<allanh1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> I know I am simple James, but what do you mean by morbid guilt?
>>>>> Allan
>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Jul 19, 2012 at 5:59 AM, James<ashkas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 7/17/2012 6:50 AM, Molly wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>> I have a friend who is contemplating self forgiveness. Any
>>>> suggestions?
>>>
>>>>>> Look back from a context of greater maturity, in the meantime apply
>>>> time
>>>>>> and experience: pursue excellence, appreciate moderation, respect
>>>> processes.
>>>
>>>>>> Through personal growth pieces of the story begin falling in place,
>>>>>> motives are replaced with expanded and stronger ones.
>>>
>>>>>> Morbid guilt might be another matter, where it mixes with identity
>>>> seems
>>>>>> very elusive. I have a friend that would much appreciate your input.
>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> (
>>>>> )
>>>>> |_D Allan
>>>
>>>>> Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.
>>>
>>> --
>>> (
>>> )
>>> |_D Allan
>>>
>>> Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.- Hide quoted text -
>>>
>>> - Show quoted text -
>